Two New Rules

by Jimmy Akin on August 25, 2007

in Internet

Have been added to Da Rulz:

23. The following terms are pejorative and their use as actual
descriptors (as opposed, for example, to quoting someone else’s use of
them for purposes of critique) constitutes rudeness: "Romanist,"
"Romish," "Roman" (when used to mean or as a substitute for
"Catholic"), "Roman Church" (when used to mean the entire Catholic
Church, as opposed to the Roman church sui iuris that exists
within the Catholic Church), "Papist," Papistic," "Papistical,"
"Popish," and any cognate terms based on the terms "Roman" or "Pope."

The term to be used on this blog is Catholic, without scare quotes.

This is a Catholic blog, and Catholics are to be called Catholics on it.

24. It constitutes rudeness to make inflammatory assertions that one
is not prepared to back up by anything more than hearsay (e.g., "Mother
Theresa prayed to Hindu idols. I know because my friend said so.").

Inflammatory claims are those likely to inflame passions. An inflammatory claim can be true. But because of its emotion-stirring character, it requires concrete evidence (more than just hearsay) to back it up if the discourse is to be kept civil and not degenerate into an impassioned muddle.

(NOTE: I’ve added clarifiers to these rules based on issues that came up in the combox below. The corresponding changes have been made to Da Rulz page as well.)

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I found this in Pope Benedict XV's Encyclical Letter Ad Beatissimi Apostolorum, 1914:
24. "It is, moreover, Our will that Catholics should abstain from certain appellations which have recently been brought into use to distinguish one group of Catholics from another. They are to be avoided not only as "profane novelties of words," out of harmony with both truth and justice, but also because they give rise to great trouble and confusion among Catholics. Such is the nature of Catholicism that it does not admit of more or less, but must be held as a whole or as a whole rejected: "This is the Catholic faith, which unless a man believe faithfully and firmly; he cannot be saved" (Athanas. Creed). There is no need of adding any qualifying terms to the profession of Catholicism: it is quite enough for each one to proclaim "Christian is my name and Catholic my surname," only let him endeavour to be in reality what he calls himself."
Seems more than appropriate to add it to this topic. "Roman" Catholic, "Liberal" Catholic, "Traditional" Catholic, "American" Catholic - all of these may be considered those appellations which our former Holy Father asked Catholics to abstain from using.

SDG,
I'm sorry I couldn't respond sooner.
Nevertheless, though of quite different degrees of offensive force, similar principles apply. It is similar to how an argument about contraception may have reference to abortion, or how an argument about homosexuality may have reference to pedophilia or bestiality. Sometimes a lesser evil can be thrown into clearer relief by reference to a greater, without implying that the two are on a plane.
That's an argument that I can't contradict. :-)
P.S. They had better not de-Arabify the Calormenes, that's all I have to say.
Aaaaaaaaamen! (BTW, the source of my concerns is the blog report by the winner of The Ultimate Fan Contest @ www.narnia.com, in case you don't already know.)

I'm probably naive to think that the "P" word isn't comparable to the "N" word, but I do.

No, I agree that papist isn't equal in offensive force to the n-word, at least in part because the history of anti-Catholicism, as ugly as it may have been, was never as ugly as slavery, and too Catholic-Protestant persecution was a two-way street in a way that white-black persecution never was.
Nevertheless, though of quite different degrees of offensive force, similar principles apply. It is similar to how an argument about contraception may have reference to abortion, or how an argument about homosexuality may have reference to pedophilia or bestiality. Sometimes a lesser evil can be thrown into clearer relief by reference to a greater, without implying that the two are on a plane.
P.S. They had better not de-Arabify the Calormenes, that's all I have to say.

...But I understand that Jimmy made the rule because of rude non-Catholics using the term disdainfully. Peace out.
P.S. Down with any possible injection of historical revisionism into the Narnia movies!!!! ;)

I'm probably naive to think that the "P" word isn't comparable to the "N" word, but I do. However, I, too, am annoyed when non-Catholics use the word, unless they are joking about all of we(?) folks over at American P@pist.

SDG,
I know. I guess I read too much "American Papist."
BTW, Did you here about the decidedly spanish/conquistador flavor for the Telmarine culture in the new Prince Caspian movie?

I like the word, and so does Thomas Peters :^)

There are black people who like the n-word. It doesn't change the pejorative and objectionable force of the term, especially from non-Catholics, just as the n-word always has pejorative force from whites.

Jimmy,
[The following constitutes]rudeness: ... "Papist," ..."
I like the word, and so does Thomas Peters :^)

"Catholic tradition contradicts all the time."
What is "All The Time," and how does the Church contradict it? tongue-in-cheek

BTW I don't think Michael was addressing you Diane. Chill.:-) God bless.

Diane,
Gerald has been banned. BTW he isn't Eastern Orthodox either he is a pathological liar. He is a Protestant Fundamentalist pretending to be Eastern Orthodox. He denounces Catholic for calling Priests FATHER & he says Mary isn't the Mother of God but the Mother of Jesus only. Both you & I know even the most anti-Catholic Eastern Orthodox person would NEVER say either of those things since they are heresy against Eastern Orthodoy. Don't feed the Troll.
Cheers!:-)

Michael: With all due respect and with all charity in Christ, please do not assume that you know my motives, which you cannot possibly know. I take no glee whatsoever. It's not schadenfreude. It is a matter of setting the record straight. Sin is an equal-opportunity affliction, and things are tough all over. But some folks want you to think that the Catholic Church has cornered the market on sin, especially lurid sexual sin. This is a special, distinct form of anti-Catholicism. I call it the Maria Monk Syndrome.
God bless,
Diane

Gerald is getting his stuff from
w3 dot christiantruth Dot com forgeries.html
william webster wrote them including the one about Aquinas and the forgeries.
heh oh gerald:I was a baptist too.
I had 5 years theology in a reformed baptist post secondary training institution.
and before I went to seminary I was spoutin' from the Westminster and the 1689 Confessions of faith. I had it down solid.
Gerald: explore Paul's understanding and implementation of the idea of 'union with Christ". Realize that the whole early church was saturated with that teaching and reality.
And then come on home to the Catholic Church.
Wayne

Take no glee in scandal in whatever Church.
It can happen to anyone and any Church.
We must all try to prevent it and protect innocents.
Our Church has much sin and crime to be accountable for.
It is the evil part of human nature--and unfortunately is emperically proven.
It is a shame that the young man on the other post thought the Russian Orthodox Church was above scandal and the Catholic Church was the only Church with scandal.
We should pray for all of this.
We should pray for the unity of all Christians.

Re Gerald and his claims that Catholics are pervs but Orthodox aren't:
Has he read OCANews.org lately?
Hint: Kodiak, Alaska.
Among other cases.

I don't claim much liguistical knowledge about the term "nigger" and its offensive history. It obviously is derived (like so many American words) from an elide of another word, "negro."
Actually, I think "negro" is Spanish and "nigger" Porteguese

Howdy SDG--
Thanks for your comment. I don't claim much liguistical knowledge about the term "nigger" and its offensive history. It obviously is derived (like so many American words) from an elide of another word, "negro." All I can say is that during the entirety of my life, the term always has been a nasty one.
As for my neighbor's bible study, how they gonna get a catholic interpretation if a catholic doesn't show up? I'm probably the only papist they know...LOL.
As an aside, looking at all of these arguments, I feel really, really blessed. When I was in my teens and went shopping for a church, the Lord let me know in no uncertain terms that he wanted me a Roman Catholic. I am very grateful that I didn't have to rely on a debate about scripture and my own brain about what was and was not true.
So, God bless all you seekers of truth out there. Sometimes these arguments about what Jesus said and what he meant are the devil's own sneaky way of diverting our attention from Jesus himself---
Lighten up fellas..
Celeste

Catholic assume that there is only one tradition. There are multiple traditions. Russian Orthodox have their tradition, Catholics have 23 traditions, and Protestants have their traditions.
And the Bible speaks of traditions variously. You yourself quoted:
"See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ."
but there is also
"Therefore, brothers, stand firm and hold fast to the traditions that you were taught, either by an oral statement or by a letter of ours."
Now, the question is whether the "traditions" of the second quote can mean those of differing churches. Clearly it can not, because then different beliefs would be taught, and the truth is one.

We know from The Bible that the apostle Peter was not in Rome. There was a Simon Peter in Rome after the death of Christ but it is not the apostle Peter that was a fisherman from Jerusalem.
Where in the Bible does it speak of a Simon Peter other than the apostle?

My conclusion after much travel is that only 5% if Roman Catholics have a clear understanding of their belief. The remaining 95% are going to Hell
Is this "clear understanding" you demand within the powers of a little child to understand?
"At that time Jesus said in reply, 'I give praise to you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, for although you have hidden these things from the wise and the learned you have revealed them to the little children.'"
And, anyway, where in the Bible does it say we are saved by understanding? It is faith in Jesus that is required.

Was Jesus charitable to the Pharisees and Sadducees? No! He knew that they were destined for Hell because they had no interest for repenting for their wicked ways.
Of course Jesus was charitable toward the Pharisees and the Sadducees! He warned them that their wicked ways would lead them to Hell.
Like, say, "You belong to your father the devil and you willingly carry out your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning and does not stand in truth, because there is no truth in him. When he tells a lie, he speaks in character, because he is a liar and the father of lies."

GeraldGeorge,
In case you missed the disinvitation:
FOR MULTIPLE, EGREGIOUS RULE 1 INFRACTIONS, GERALD IS HEREBY DISINVITED TO PARTICIPATE IN THE BLOG.
DO NO POST AGAIN OR MATTERS WILL BE ESCALLATED.
Posted by: Jimmy Akin | Aug 30, 2007 11:07:37 AM

Take care and God bless,
Inocencio
J+M+J

Funny, I can't seem to find any prior posts on this thread by anyone using the handle "George". Now, given how many posts there are, I guess I could have missed one. But I've got this sneaking suspicion, augmented by the similarity of language structure and lack of coherent thinking, that it's the same (banned) liar using a new handle.

"What we got he-ah is fail-ya t'communicate."

Gerald, you are a liar. You are a lying liar who lies, and the worst thing is that you justify it in your own mind because you choose to believe that Catholicism is so evil that whatever is necessary to oppose it must be justified.
"Spiritual barometer" my big toe callus. "Thanks for falling into the trap." What angel or vision commissioned you to put forward lying apologetics and "traps" to "test" and entrap Jimmy's readers? Who made you a judge over your brethren, or if you will not so dignify us, over your fellow man?
Furthermore, you have been disinvited to participate on Jimmy's blog due to your complete refusal to honor house rules of courtesy. Go and sin no more. God be with you.

It is interesting to see that people really don't know what they believe. I gave a large number of Bible quotes and people felt insulted. Notice Jesus used scripture to defeat the Devil. I must therefore assume Jimmy Aiken is scared of the Bible, and the truth it exposes.
Catholic Answers is filled with ad hominems, so if you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen.
Holy Tradition can never contradict scripture. Catholic tradition contradicts all the time.

Theresa,
I deliberately put that quote about the father on to this site to test the spiritual barometer. It proves that most people care more about if someone is a Protestant or Catholic then seeing if the statement is true or not. Thanks for falling into the trap. It proves that most people don't care about researching multiple sides to an argument.

This thread is becoming far too esoteric for me.
Bon nuit.

Heh. I'm not anonymous, and I don't use new handles in every thread. Plus, I'm more than twice Some Day's age.

Ecce homo
Does the SD in SDG stand for "Some Day"? I thought this was a Latin-free blog. Zulu proverbs don't mix with Latin phrases, as my pappy used to say.

Truthfully, I don't know what you're talking about.

That cinches it, B'Ernie. Ecce homo.

That's how my girlfriend answered my marriage proposal.

Ha! It's a line from a Herzog film. More than one, actually.

I apologize
Truthfully, I don't know what you're talking about.

I still haven't figured out if we're engaged.

I cannot hear what you say for the thunder of what you are.
That's how my girlfriend answered my marriage proposal.

Truthfully, I don't know what you're talking about.

Then I apologize, Ernie. Or is it Bert? Or B'Art? My Laura-sense just won't stop tingling. I cannot hear what you say for the thunder of what you are.

Jimmy,
How about setting up a permanent place on this site for the Protestant v. Catholic debate? There could be different rooms for different topics. If people start to get into it, you could tell them to “take it to the room.” Otherwise, it kind of degenerates into a 500+ comment muck.

Tell me truthfully that you don't know what I'm talking about, and I'll owe you an apology.
Truthfully, I don't know what you're talking about. Like I posted already, reading this board is penance for my wife.

I remember being in a Barnes and Noble with a priest once when some guy came up randomly and quoted the verse about not calling any man father. Without missing a beat, the priest asked "Do you call your father 'father'?" The guy admitted that he didn't, and was forced to sulk away in stunned silence.

No. How about a bath?

Tell me truthfully that you don't know what I'm talking about, and I'll owe you an apology.

By any chance is your wife's name Laura? I smell something familiar.
No. How about a bath?

Echoing Inocencio's applause and laughter for Smoky Mountain Renaissance :^)

Whoops!
I missed a couple of posts - sorry, Jimmy.

"The Catholic Church says that priests are to be called 'Father', yet Jesus forbade this (Matthew 23:9, John 17:11)."
Gerald:
Russian Orthodox call their priests "Father." You're not Russian Orthodox - you must be a protestant.

Ernie,
It is the same for my wife. The green screen my family calls it.
Take care and God bless,
Inocencio
J+M+J

Interesting. For my wife, reading Jimmy's blog is her penance.

By any chance is your wife's name Laura? I smell something familiar.

For Lent I gave up reading and posting comments on Jimmy's blog.
Interesting. For my wife, reading Jimmy's blog is her penance.

Smoky Mountain,
Any other questions?
No, just applause and laughter.
I completely understand taking a break. For Lent I gave up reading and posting comments on Jimmy's blog.
Now raise your virtual glass or mug...a toast to the Renaissance period of the Golden Years!
Take care and God bless,
Inocencio
J+M+J

Why did you stop?
I'm a handle artist. Much like any other artist, I go through various periods.
My early days were the Dark Years, in which my handle was "Going Deaf" and I gave Esau a hard time for his use of bold. (Sorry Esau!).
That was followed by the Classical Period in which I adopted the "Smoky Mountain Hiker" moniker.
However, I would was never one to stagnate; my development as an artist quickly blossomed as I entered the Golden Years you so dearly miss in which I modified my handle to suit my post.
Disaster struck, however. I found I was spending way too much time reading the comments on this blog and posting my own gibberish. Thus, with much self-discipline, I abstained from posting on this blog for several months. Those were the Silent Age.
Curiosity is a dangerous friend, however, and I found myself once again reading Mr. Akin's site from time to time, until ONE FINE DAY I could restrain my artistic nature no longer and I resumed my "contributions" as merely Smoky Mountain. Hence you are in the middle of the Modern Period.
However, every age comes to an end, most often through external means. Your comment, harkening back to the Golden Years, has inspired a new Renaissance of handle manipulation. I now official proclaim this the Smoky Mountain Renaissance.
Any other questions?

Smoky Mountain,
Of which 3 had substance.
Well that puts you three ahead of me! I used to like when you would add to your name for each post. Why did you stop?
Take care and God bless,
Inocencio
J+M+J

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