Bad News In Connecticut–Part II

by Jimmy Akin on September 28, 2007

in Moral Theology

In my prior post, I mentioned that I’ve received multiple requests for comment on the Connecticut Plan B situation. The following reader expresses the sentiments of many when he writes:

Jimmy,

What is going on in Connecticut right now?  The Bishops there have
released a statement, explaining that they will now allow Plan B to be
administered in their hospitals…where they previously stated (or
implied) otherwise.  Curt Jester & American Papist have coverage on
this, but I just don’t understand the issue.

Specifically, why is contraception allowed after rape (since it’s
sex without the proper intent etc etc) but is NOT permitted after
casual, recreational sex that also lacks the proper intent?

It’s understandable, given the Church’s strong stand against contraception and abortion, why this issue would be so confusing. In order to make sense of it, we need to look at several things, but first

THE BIG RED DISCLAIMER: What I am about to write is not indicative of my own view. I’m trying to explain the apparent reasoning of the Connecticut bishops. I’m not saying that they are correct or incorrect. Rome could rule either way on this, and it may well get involved. What I’m trying to do is explain a position, not defend it.

The starting point to understanding the apparent reasoning behind the Connecticut bishops’ statement is a close reading of Pope Paul VI’s encyclical, Humanae Vitae. Here’s the key line in Latin:

Item quivis respuendus est actus, qui, cum coniugale commercium vel
praevidetur vel efficitur vel ad suos naturales exitus ducit, id tamquam finem
obtinendum aut viam adhibendam intendat, ut procreatio impediatur.

Now, I’ve given this in Latin so that you can see the key term coniugale commercium. Coniugale means "conjugal/marital/pertaining to or proper to marriage." Commercium means "commerce/traffic/relations/intercourse/sexual intercourse."

You could translate this literally as "conjugal intercourse," "conjugal relations," "marital intercourse," "marital relations"–things of that nature.

Which is how this passage is translated when it’s quoted in the Catechism:

2370 Periodic continence, that is, the methods of birth regulation based on self-observation and the use of infertile periods, is in conformity with the objective criteria of morality. These methods respect the bodies of the spouses, encourage tenderness between them, and favor the education of an authentic freedom. In contrast, "every action which, whether in anticipation of the conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render procreation impossible" is intrinsically evil

Unfortunately, some translators are sloppy in how they handle this text (which is particularly unfortunate, since it’s a key text in a sensitive document). For example, the English translation of HV on the Vatican web site renders this:

Similarly excluded is any action which either before, at the moment of, or after sexual intercourse, is specifically intended to prevent procreation—whether as an end or as a means.

That’s a loosey-goosey translation, and if you go with that one, what the Connecticut bishops said will be absolutely inexplicable, since the use of Plan B to prevent ovulation or fertilization clearly would be "specifically intended to prevent procreation . . . as an end . . . after sexual intercourse" (rearranging the elements of the quote a bit).

But that’s not what the Latin original says. It doesn’t say "sexual intercourse," it says "conjugal intercourse" and "conjugal" means "marital."

Paul VI phrased himself very carefully in this area, and what he did
was say that you can’t use contraception to thwart the procreative
aspect of marital intercourse. His language does not explicitly
address the issue of the procreative aspect of intercourse
outside of marriage.

Of course, intercourse outside of marriage always involves grave sin to begin
with, and it seems reasonable to conclude that if contraception in
marriage is an evil, contraception outside of marriage only compounds
the evil of non-marital sex. One day the pope or the Congregation
for the Doctrine of the Faith may clarify that this is indeed the case.

But this goes beyond what can be shown from the language of HV. The way HV is phrased
in the original Latin (and in the literal translation of the passage
given in the Catechism), all you can say with certainty is that Paul VI
condemned all use of contraception within marriage.

He did not address–or cannot be ascertained certainly as addressing–the situation of sexual relations outside of marriage.

Thus, some have held that at least some forms of contraception (ones
that aren’t abortifacient, for example) might not compound the evil of
non-marital sex. Some might argue that, although non-marital sexual acts are gravely wrong,
contraceptive non-marital sex might be less gravely wrong than non-contraceptive non-marital sex since it has a lesser risk of bringing a child into the world outside of wedlock.

By divine law, children have a right to be conceived only within a
family that has a father and a mother who are married to each
other. To the extent that they may cause children to be conceived
outside of wedlock, non-marital sexual acts can be viewed as grave sins against
charity regarding the child that may be conceived, as well as other
affected parties (such as innocent spouses).

In case of rape, one pursuing this line of argument might maintain, there is no sin in the victim using at least certain forms of contraception since the victim is not married to the rapist (apart from cases of marital rape) and did not consent to the sexual act.

Thus the U. S. bishops Ethical and Religious Directives for Catholic Health Care Services (4th ed.) states:

Compassionate and understanding care should be given to a person who is
the victim of sexual assault. Health care providers should cooperate
with law enforcement officials and offer the person psychological and
spiritual support as well as accurate medical information. A female who
has been raped should be able to defend herself against a potential
conception from the sexual assault. If, after appropriate testing,
there is no evidence that conception has occurred already, she may be
treated with medications that would prevent ovulation, sperm
capacitation, or fertilization. It is not permissible, however, to
initiate or to recommend treatments that have as their purpose or
direct effect the removal, destruction, or interference with the
implantation of a fertilized ovum
[n. 36].

The issue of non-marital contraception is a theological hot potato that the Holy See will eventually have to sort out, because this issue is not going to go away, as the situation of the Connecticut state law illustrates.

But if–and note the "if"–the Church ended up endorsing the view that contraception is impermissible within marriage but potentially permissible outside it then it would allow for a variety of situations, such as:

  • Nuns in dangerous situations where they may be raped could use at least some forms of contraception

  • Women who have been raped could be given at least some forms of contraception

I’m not defending these views. I’m just pointing out that they are not expressly precluded by the language used in Humanae Vitae or, to my knowledge, by subsequent Magisterial documents.

You might find the above line of reasoning entirely implausible, but I’m not advocating it. I’m merely trying to help with the "What on earth are they thinking?" factor of this situation.

If you are of the opinion that the above views are wrong, you might well conclude that the Holy Spirit will prevent the Church from ever endorsing such views and that he may guide the Church into a clear-cut rejection of those views.

But that has not yet occurred, at least in Magisterial documents that I am aware of.

In fact–and this is pure speculation and should not be taken as anything other than the pointing out of a possibility–the Connecticut bishops may even have consulted with the CDF for advice about how to handle this issue.

That leaves the question of whether the policy they announced is a good one, and, speaking only for myself, I can only say that I find the announced policy to be troubling.

There are disputed claims about whether Plan B will prevent the implantation of a newly-conceived child. The manufacturer’s own label for the product (see links to American Papist and Curt Jester) say that it may have this effect. Legal disclaimers of this nature are notoriously broad–in order to prevent future lawsuits–and they frequently list potential outcomes for the use of drugs that are either not possible with the drug in question or which are very unlikely. Because of this kind of language in medical disclaimers, as well as a lack of knowledge about how Plan B actually works, there is ambiguity about whether or not it is abortifacient.

That ambiguity is what generates a lot of the tension within the Connecticut bishops’ statement, and it is one of the things that I find troubling about the whole situation.

I’m far from being an expert on Plan B, but any time there is a possibility that something is abortifacient, I want to apply the Deerhunter Principle: If you’re out in the woods hunting, you cannot open fire if the result is reasonably foreseen to involve the possible death of a human.

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Yes Jimmy, You are right. According to me we can stop anything until they realize it.
--------------------------------
Betty
connecticut drug rehab

Doing rape is a wrong thing.
http://www.addictionrecovery.net/connecticut
*******************************
julianamercy

The spirit of Michael Augros's open letter is most constructive, unlike the bishop-bashing going on elsewhere. I hope it affects discussion at the highest levels in the Church.

An Open Letter to the Bishops of Connecticut
by Michael Augros at the First Things blog

Matt, I'd like to retract my earlier statement After reading [Bishop Lori's] statement, I have decided that my disagreement with him falls within the realm of prudential judgement rather than the realm of moral principles.
I now say that the Supreme Chaplain of the Knights of Columbus has made a moral error - not merely a prudential one. I was misled by the alleged remoteness of the possibility of death. After all, we do risk death every day under the assumption that the risk is remote (driving to work for example).
What separates the lawful activities which risk death from the unlawful situation of Plan B is that with Plan B, the desired result might be achieved through rather than despite the risk of death. The risk of killing in a car someone does not actually help us achieve the desired objective of getting somewhere faster.
But the risk of killing in Plan B does help achieve the desired objective. Not even in warfare or self-defense does death necessarily help us achieve our desired objectives. The cases where it does are classified as war crimes.
Achieving desired objectivities through rather than despite death is the very definition of the culture of death. The decision of the Connecticut Bishops has poisoned their Dioceses and the Knights of Columbus with the culture of death that Pope John Paul II implored us to overcome.

Esau,
possibly preventing implantation
That is abortifacient. It's preventing implantation of a fertilized embryo-- a human being.
God Bless,
Matt

I'm not sure if this has already been posted as I'm still reading through all the comments, but I thought it useful to point out that Plan B has three possible mechanisms of action. Prevention ovulation is only one, it can also effect the movement of sperm...
My ref here is Epocrates, a database commonly used by healthcare professionals for drug info.
https://online.epocrates.com/u/10a2474/Plan+B
Mechanism Of Action
alters tubal transport of ova and/or sperm, preventing ovulation or fertilization; alters endometrium, possibly preventing implantation

DSJ:
Thank-you for that!
I had my suspicions, but just couldn't be sure; which is one of the reasons why wouldn't actually classify this as an abortifacient or find anything particularly immoral if the bishops actually permitted its use for rape victims.

I'm not sure if this has already been posted as I'm still reading through all the comments, but I thought it useful to point out that Plan B has three possible mechanisms of action. Prevention ovulation is only one, it can also effect the movement of sperm...
My ref here is Epocrates, a database commonly used by healthcare professionals for drug info.
https://online.epocrates.com/u/10a2474/Plan+B
Mechanism Of Action
alters tubal transport of ova and/or sperm, preventing ovulation or fertilization; alters endometrium, possibly preventing implantation

Gang,
stop feeding the troll.
Back to the subject at hand:
NCBC publishes statement on Connecticut Bishop's Plan B decision (with commentary) - on American Papist
the NCBC understands the judgment of the Connecticut bishops that the administration of a contraceptive medication in the absence of an ovulation test is not an intrinsically evil act. However, it is immoral to violate one’s conscience, including the corporate consciences of health care agencies, and the unwillingness of the state to allow an exemption of conscience makes the law unjust and onerous.
God Bless,
Matt

Etal,
"Still waiting for an answer to my oriinal request for some definitive sentencing guidelines. How should illegal abortion be punished? What should the penalty be and who should receive it?"
I don't know why you're still waiting; I answered this question immediately by saying that it should be treated just the same as any other murder. Did you even read my post?
"Hint: Try changing the culture, not the law (compare the efforts of MADD to make alcohol uncool/unfunny and their positive results with the abject legalistic failiure of Prohibition in the 1920s)."
Hello?! Drunk driving IS illegal! (It is Mothers Against DRUNK DRIVING). But perhaps you think it shouldn't be?
Really, just be honest that you aren't really pro-life. If abortion is murder then of course it should be illegal and be punished. If abortion isn't murder then you have no reason to be 'personally opposed'.

Tim, my guess is that etal's avoidance of any real discussion is because he/she actually supports abortion and to go out on a limb, is trolling for material to use against those who defend life.

OK Esau, how would you punish abortion? What would be the penalties and who would recieve them?
etal,
Just because we can't/wouldn't punish folks for acts of abortion doesn't negate the fact that abortion still is MURDER -- regardless of your playful attempts at semantics (not to mention, your either/or fallacy).

Etal-
You conveniently avoided commenting on anything I said, except to say that I was "afraid" of being logically consistent, without actually showing at all where I WAS inconsistent.
Why do you hate women?

Theoretically, 800K women behind bars won't cause me to lose sleep at night. In several states, certain sexual acts were banned under law. This didn't result in even a minority of offenders behind bars. There are some schools of jurisprudence that believe you should make the law very specific and enforce it vigorously. I do not come from that school. I come from the school that says law should establish principles, and judges (and prosecutors) should be given wide discretion. In practical terms, I would not support the suspensions of liberty required and resources that would need to be allocated for 800K successful prosecutions.

(BTW, you completely missed my point)
Not really --
Hint: Try changing the culture, not the law (compare the efforts of MADD to make alcohol uncool/unfunny and their positive results with the abject legalistic failiure of Prohibition in the 1920s).
Perhaps back then, instead of changing the law concerning Slavery, we should have just made Slavery sound 'uncool', huh?

etal, you claim to be pro-life, but your all your posts suggest that you are playing word games. Does your definition of "pro-life" allow abortions?
Now why don't you respond to my question and indicate why you are not the abortion supporter that you walk and talk like.

...the equivalency of miscarriage to manslaughter...
Why would miscarriage be equivalent to manslaughter?
There are those women where the miscarriage is a result of their unfortunate biology or perhaps even a hysterectomy they had to get due to cancer.

OK Esau, how would you punish abortion? What would be the penalties and who would recieve them?
(BTW, you completely missed my point)

"I think 15 years is reasonable."
So you would put the 800K+ women who have abortions each year into prison for only MOST of their remaining lives. Why shouldn't they get the death penalty?
"There's significant evidence that they aren't accidental."
By your own statement you would agree with my previous point (which nobody seems to want to answer) concerning the equivalency of miscarriage to manslaughter or negligent homicide if abortion equalled murder.
"As a practical matter, the woman will more often be given immunity to testify against the abortionist."
So do a lot of accesories involved in murder cases. Your point is what exactly?
"I did take them to the logical conclusion."
No, you weren't logically consistent. You want to ban abortion because its murder, but don't want to punish it like murder.

Hint: Try changing the culture, not the law (compare the efforts of MADD to make alcohol uncool/unfunny and their positive results with the abject legalistic failiure of Prohibition in the 1920s).
Etal:
Are you seriously regarding acts of murder (which is what abortion basically is as the end result is the death of an infant) as being equivalent to that of alcholism?
There's a substantial difference between the two!

Tim, women who have abortions are at least accesories to murder. In most states this buys you the death penalty as much as anyone who actually pulls a trigger.
So why are you all so afraid to be logically consistent?

"Etal has not responded to my request to do something other than walk and talk like someone supporting abortion."
I am pro-life.
Now why don't you respod to my question, what makes you think the legal/judicial route is the only or best way to oppose abortion?
Hint: Try changing the culture, not the law (compare the efforts of MADD to make alcohol uncool/unfunny and their positive results with the abject legalistic failiure of Prohibition in the 1920s).

For how long? Life without parole as with other murderers?
I think 15 years is reasonable. Life without parole is not a common sentence. Mitigating factors should be taken into consideration. If an abused child murders his parents, we don't send him to prison for life. That doesn't make us relativists.
You wouldn't pursue murder? Why not?
How are these accidental deaths even remotely related to the premeditated murder committed during abortion?
There's significant evidence that they aren't accidental. The problem with these cases and abortion cases is proving criminality. As a practical matter, the woman will more often be given immunity to testify against the abortionist. This is no different than the girls at a house of ill repute not being charged with prostitution when charges are being pursued against the owner of the house of ill repute.
Why are you all so afraid of taking your own beliefs to their logical and legal conclusions?
I did take them to the logical conclusion. You don't like my conclusion, but that doesn't make it illogical.

Etal, you overlook the fact that most of the time, women are the VICTIMS of abortion, right along with their babies.
The doctors are under no mental strain, no duress... they are not teenagers making decisions in a panic based on bad information or advice. They coldly and calculatedly perform abortions in order to make money.
There might be women who will be the rare exception and could be legitimately accused of murder, but because of the kind of mitigating factors I mentioned above, that is doubtful. Even most women who murder their own children in their beds or drown them in the bathtub are understood by most people to be mentally ill.
This isn't always the case. Women can be selfish monsters, as well as men. But in cases of infanticide that is rare. Abortion is not the same thing, but most of these young women - girls - are desperate and have been deceived, pressured or coerced to boot.
That is why prosecution should be reserved for only the obvious cases of callous disregard for the life of the unborn child.
No, making abortion illegal will not result in great numbers of women going to jail, and it shouldn't.

"you are wasting your time at the moment in your antagonistic questions"
My questions are antagonistisonly if you are afraid of the consequences of your beliefs.

"As society's collective views toward abortion changes, sentencing can become harsher."
If society's views towards abortion change, you won't have to bother changing the law.
Its also extremely hypocritical and cowardly to call abortion murder and then not punish it as murder. Where is the courage of your convictions?

"I have no issue with sending women to prison for having abortions."
For how long? Life without parole as with other murderers?
"As a matter of prosecutorial discretion, I don't think the matter should be pursued,"
You wouldn't pursue murder? Why not?
"much like SIDS isn't thoroughly investigated and deaths in nursing homes aren't. "
How are these accidental deaths even remotely related to the premeditated murder committed during abortion?
Why are you all so afraid of taking your own beliefs to their logical and legal conclusions?

The only thing that is apparent about my beliefs from my comments is that spending energy on talking sentencing is practically pointless when our energies should be concentrated on stopping abortion.
I gave you a point from which you could start your own thoughts. If that failed to help you, I'm sorry I wasted my words. If it did not help you, perhaps you can explain what preconceived position it is that you have to help us understand your questions. However, I strongly believe you are wasting your time at the moment in your antagonistic questions when you can be concentrating on ridding the world of the scourge of abortion.
Really, the only situation on why you want to even attempt to carrry on the situation is that you are sympathetic with the abortionist's cause. I think you need to explain yourself more fully to earn people's respect for your questions.

Etal, you missed or ignored my last post.
Ben, etal ignored my post also. Etal has not responded to my request to do something other than walk and talk like someone supporting abortion. In fact, etal is proving my point that his/her post was a provocation as he/she is ignoring anyone who doesn't rise to the bait.
It's the same sort of duplicitous behavior demonstrated by the Aurora PP and the only effective response is to shine light on it.

Ben, why should abortion murderers, including the women, be punished less then other types of murderers?
Society does not change overnight. We are still trying to weed out racism 140 years after slavery was made illegal throughout the Union.
Making abortion illegal, with any form of punishment attached to violations (fines, some imprisonment, etc.) would likely reduce the number of abortions and therefore would be better than not making abortion illegal. Even just punishing the offending doctors would likely severely limit the number of abortions performed.
As generations pass, hopefully society will grow in a collective belief that abortion is horrific, much as the majority of society now believes that racism is horrific.
As society's collective views toward abortion changes, sentencing can become harsher. But better to start somewhere NOW than endure legal abortion for another 40 years.

"but give me the day when abortions are illegal first, then let's talk about sentencing"
The whole point of my original comment was to ask what happens after it is made illegal.
Apparently, none of you have really thought this through yet or examined all of the implications. Now if you don't want to do either, feel free not to respond.

Etal, you missed or ignored my last post. Please, out of charity, refrain from visiting sentencing comments addressed to me again. I'll repeat myself (again) for you: "but give me the day when abortions are illegal first, then let's talk about sentencing".
Happy blessed St. Francis of Assissi day!

Ben, why should abortion murderers, including the women, be punished less then other types of murderers?
Why are you so squeemish?

I have no issue with sending women to prison for having abortions. As a matter of prosecutorial discretion, I don't think the matter should be pursued, much like SIDS isn't thoroughly investigated and deaths in nursing homes aren't. Pro-lifers make this a lot harder than it needs to be.

Etal, I attempted to answer your question to give you a starting point to think about some possibilities. I sincerely hope it helps you, but from now on I'm just going to quote myself, my own advice I probably should have heeded a half hour ago: "but give me the day when abortions are illegal first, then let's talk about sentencing". Since we know abortion should be illegal, let's concentrate all our efforts on making it illegal for the moment.

Without giving it much thought, I think Ben's on to something -- focus the punishment on the offending doctors.

Ben, why only fine those guilty of murder? Why are you letting them off so easy? Why not puish the women, aren't they equally guilty under the law? And if abortion were not equal to murder, why make it illegal?
As for making them enter programs that feature a correct theology of the body, how is this different than living in a theocracy like Iran?

I'll bite: sentencing is an interesting point. Murder is still murder, and abortion is objectively murder and always will be. Yet some people, recognizably, are still blind to this basic fact. Seeking capital punishment against those blind souls and destroying the otherwise good practices of some of these doctors would seem to be lamentable, if it were necessary, but out of charity I suspect it is going (way) too far. Originally, I just assumed that you can attack future illegal abortions by levying huge fines at the doctors. For the most part that would probably shut down abortionist doctors real quick, but for those with ultra rich clients, it just puts a price tag on the unborn's life which is unacceptable.
Ok, sharks, feed on this proposal (below), which I hope has the merit of being practical. I don't even endorse it yet myself since there is a lot to think about, but I can't see it as a horrible first attempt either:
If abortions are illegal in this country, given our recent past where they were legal, then fine each doctor $1,000,000 for the first conviction with 1-3 years in prison, with $10,000,000 and life sentencing for further convictions. Don't punish the women, despite their equal or worse complicitness in the crime, except by making them enter programs that feature a correct theology of the body, whereby they hopefully learn about the heinousness of their acts. The state then leaves their consciences to God which is about as best as the state can practically do.
I think if these laws were enforced, the abortion rate would practically disappear overnight without overturning society as we know it.
Ugh, what a mess, but give me the day when abortions are illegal first, then let's talk about sentencing. Mary, Mother of God, pray for us.
Ben

Mary Kay, what makes you think that the legal/judicial route is the only way or even the best way to oppose abortion?

Etal, how can you demand an answer when you evidently have not been honest with us? Why should any of us answer your sentencing provocation - and yes, it was a provocation - when you walk and talk the very opposite of what you claim to be, pro-life.

As a follow up, it should be noted that if abortion is clasified as "murder" it logically, legally and morally follows that miscarriage is at least potential "manslaughter" or "negligent homicide" - at least until a police investigation clears the mother of wrongful or negiligent behavior.
Do you want every miscarraige to be investigated by the police for possible wrong doing?

Asking if you all have thought through the consequences of making abortion illegal is a provocation?
Still waiting for an answer to my oriinal request for some definitive sentencing guidelines. How should illegal abortion be punished? What should the penalty be and who should receive it?

Etal, I would guess that Elijah simply forgot to add /sarcasm.
I always interested in people who say they are "personally opposed to abortion, but..." Maybe it's because 99.9 percent of their words support abortion. Your phrase, that you are "personally pro-life," yet also say "If abortion = murder" (I cleaned up your typo) is inconsistent. Bottom line: I'm not buying into your attempt to provoke until you explain what you mean by being pro-life in terms that people here would recognize.

Etal,
Why are you assuming that the number of abortions would stay exactly the same once abortion were illegal? No one proposes that those who've had abortions during the time that it was legal be charged with a crime. The whole point of making it illegal is to reduce the number.
Secondly, apply your reasoning to any other crime and it doesn't hold up. Yes, it would be more 'cost effective' to execute all criminals rather than feed and house them. It just doesn't follow that the solution is making their crimes legal.
Thirdly, and I'm not going to start the death penalty debate here since it's not the topic, I don't see why, after abortion is made illegal and everyone knows it and knows the penalty that will be imposed for commission of it, it shouldn't be treated as any other murder since that's what it is.
This 'personally opposed, but...' stuff never comes from concern for the victim of the violence.

As a follow up Elijah, FYI, there are a little over 3,000 American convicts on death row (2005 data) for crimes committed over a period of many years, while about 810,000 abortions were performed during the same year.
Now counting the women who have abortions (along with their doctors and an assumed equal number of accesories) the number of people added to death row for abortion would be about double this number, or 1,620,000 EACH year (at current rates).
That would represent a 540x increase each year in our current death row population.
Meanwhile, America's current prison population is 2,186,230 inmates (2005 data). Life in prison for abortion would result in annual increases of about 75% in our prison population.
Are you sure you all have thought this thing through completely?

So Elijah you are more in favor of life in prison without possibility of parole for those who commit the crime of abortion (the women, their doctors, accessories, etc.)
Wouldn't it be more cost efective to have them all executed instead of spending all the money deed to double/triple the size of our prison system?

Yeah, I'm personally opposed to rape too, but despite the fact that its illegal it still happens. So why are we paying money for all the prison space to house rapists. We should just legalize the rapes. Problem solved for everyone.

Though personally pro-life, I do have some problems concerning the practical aspects of a possible legal ban on abortion. Specifically, I was hoping if some of you here could provide some sentencing guidelines for the hypothetical situation (which many of you are striving to make real) where abortion is a crime.
Now the reason for making abortion a crime would be that it is considered to be the murder of a helpless human being. Should a woman having an abortion and the doctor performing it get the death penalty for this crime, as they would in most states for other types of murder? Accessories to murder are also subject to the death penalty, so wouldnt' that include anyone who assists the woman in getting an abortion from the boyfriend who persuades her to have one to the friend who drives her to the (now underground) clinic?
If abortion = muder, why shouldn't the death penalty be imposed? A lesser puishment wouldn't fit the crime of premeditated murder, now would it?
However, in a few states without the death penalty, life imprisonment is the punishment for murder. Should the millions of women who have abortions and the thousands of doctors who perform them, and the accessories described above, be given life in prison? Do you wish to build enough prisons to house an effective doubling (tripling?) of America's already over crowded prison population?
What should the punishment be for the crime of abortion? Opinions please.

Co-don, here...
Aw, shucks, guys, I'm flattered...I think!? I've become a living legend. Where's my prize, hmmm \:(
If the topic of this thread weren't so blamed frustrating/depressing, I would take you all on in a pun contest, with one frontal lobe tied behind my back (wait, that doesn't sound right...).
Well, I must skulk away, now, and work on my Dmitri Mendeleev impersonation. I must be the only chemistry professor who gives a lecture on the periodic table in a Russian accent. I would have thought it was the obvious way to go.
P.S. I know, I know...chemistry, eweee...part-time humor scholars have to eat, too...
P. P. S. I really do have a long-winded, very pedantic, tedious analysis of this thread topic (complete with charts), but every time I start to talk about non-independent modal probability theory and its effects on deontic logic, people start to laugh. Maybe, if I tell it with a Russian accent...yeah, let me see...
P. P. P. S. Mary Kay, if you meant some other, Donald...never mind...
For x = 1 to 4, Do
P.
End
S.
I have found the discussion of this topic both sad and helpful. In the midst of all of the fussing, fighting, arguing, and making-up in this combox, I hope everyone has thought to say a prayer for those unfortunate people who are caught in the middle of all of this (bishops, lawmakers, laymen, and victims).
Sometimes, if we allow ourselves to become really, really small and very, very thin in our own sight -- if we begin to realize who we are in God's eyes -- that very small, very thin wisp of loved dirt, that nothingness that stands blind and begging before Everything, then, then, we begin to realize something very big and wide: that small prayers and thin hopes can sometimes slip through cracks the mind cannot yet follow and solve a lifetime of problems in a single, Amen. I cannot, yet, tell if mind or prayer is being tested in this situation. I can only tell that I am being tested.
Aren't we all...

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